Georgia Lomas:
You’re listening to the Journey to Zero podcast hosted by Alltruck Zero. If you want to stay ahead of the game and find out more about the very latest green truck technology, or you’re looking for hints and tips on how to decarbonise your own fleet, then this is the place for you. In this podcast, we’ll be sitting down with the thought leaders who are guiding the way on the journey we’re all on as we work to carbonise the transport industry.
Georgia Lomas:
Welcome Ken Scott from Tevva to the Alltruck Zero podcast.
Ken Scott:
Good afternoon. Yeah, thank you.
Georgia Lomas:
No worries.
Ken Scott:
Delighted to be here.
Georgia Lomas:
Thank you for joining us. Ken, could you please introduce yourself and your role at Tevva?
Ken Scott:
Yeah, sure. So I’m the managing director at Tevva. I’ve been with Tevva for three years now. Originally joined as the chief engineer. I’ve actually got. I was counting up in preparation for this and can’t believe it, but it’s over 37 years in automotive. That’s from Land Rover to Bentley Motors, to Volkswagen and to Alexander Dennis. And my aim for Tevva as managing director is quite simple, basically to scale up the Tevva business to make sure we’re at the forefront of truck decarbonisation.
Georgia Lomas:
Brilliant. Could you give us an introduction to Tevva?
Ken Scott :
Yeah, sure. We’ve actually been in existence for ten years. We are somewhere between a startup and a scale up business that therefore translates into it’s a roller coaster ride. While we establish ourselves, we have a very simple mission that we’re all aligned to, which is that we do technology because it matters to humanity. So we’re very focused on introducing technology that’s going to make a difference. And right now we see that as technology that decarbonises the transportation sector. It’s been a process over the ten years of various phases. We actually won a project and delivered some trucks to ups, and that allowed us to learn about batteries, how to make batteries, all the software around batteries, learned how to work with customers in this field, et cetera.
Ken Scott:
And they’ve gone on to accumulate so far, 500,000 customer operation. So that means then that we’ve been able to take that technology and apply it to the next phase, which is the truck that we’re in the process of ramping up right now, which is the seven and a half ton pure BeV truck. But again, it’s taken a lot of the learning points and the battle scars and the problems that we’ve solved for these battle scars, if you like, into that new truck that we’re ramping up with right now. And then, in the future, what are we going to do? Well, hydrogen gives us the best solution for long range truck application, so we’re in the process of developing a dual energy product, compromising a hydrogen and battery electric technology, and that will optimise fully the sort of range, payload and cost equation.
Georgia Lomas:
Brilliant. So the development of the hydrogen, truck, how’s it going? Have you come across any blockers?
Ken Scott:
Yeah, well, first of all, we’ve got a couple of prototypes, one seven and a half ton product and one nine ton product. And so far they’re working well. They’re doing some early test work. A lot of that’s been on test tracks, but we actually have had one of these products out on the public roads. It did a trip that proved real world conditions and benefits of this, and it achieved 350 miles of public road use in one trip as a range, which is fantastic and absolutely underpinning why we know that this is the ultimate answer for commercial vehicles. But having said all of that, our concentration right now is on that pure BEV vehicle through the trials and the ramp up of the production. The reason for that is that the vast majority of that BeV truck underpins the hydrogen dual energy vehicle. So this first stage gives us the ability to prove the reliability of the technology before we then take it to that next stage and therefore go with customers with confidence that this all works.
Ken Scott:
And as for hydrogen, why hydrogen? It’s that balancing act I referred to earlier in terms of range, payload and cost. Hydrogen. If you go pure BeV for heavy trucks, then you’ll have no payload because it’ll all be used by batteries. They’re heavy and also they’re expensive. Hydrogen gives you, if you can get it right, a good balance that allows a payload that’s acceptable to customers.
Georgia Lomas:
What sets the Tevva electric trucks apart from the competitors’options?
Ken Scott:
Sure. First and foremost, it’s easy from a driver’s perspective, to transition from a diesel vehicle to ours. It’s a familiar environment, lots of controls and buttons in the same places that they’re familiar with from current diesel products. They can sit straight into the product and suddenly they’re in a familiar environment. And it doesn’t take long to pick up, therefore, how to use the vehicle and get on with their job every day. There’s also many parts with our vehicles, like windscreens, wiper motors, door window motors, et cetera, that are existing parts and easily available at normal prices in the established aftermarket. So, again, it’s easy for our customers to add this to the fleet without being punished for the parts cost point of view, there’s no complex charging infrastructure needed to get started. It’s fairly standard depot charging that’s needed.
Ken Scott:
And I would also say I haven’t looked at how to the lead times involved with ordering diesel products right now. Rather bizarrely, they’re rather lengthy. Well, we’re ready to go. We can satisfy a customer order with a specification for a box body, et cetera, within about six months. And that’s very competitive compared to the diesel waiting list right now. And as I say, this is effectively our third generation of technology with hundreds of thousands of kilometers of on the road deployment already behind us. And I guess, last of all, we’re proudly british. And investing in the personal touch that allows our UK based customers to be efficiently and effectively looked after from our base is something that clearly we’re never going to be able to do that forever.
Ken Scott:
But by being able to concentrate on that means that we can effectively and easily, as a complete business, walk in our customers shoes. And it therefore means that when we do scale up beyond that into other markets, we’re in an excellent place.
Georgia Lomas:
So what challenges have you had to overcome with the introduction of these new electric trucks?
Ken Scott:
Sure. Well, developing an EV, and I’ve said this, this is about a third time I’ve said this in this, but it’s a constant balancing act. Range payload and cost. Range payload cost. And trying to get the ultimate solution that satisfies all three of these has always been a challenge right from the start with this. But then there’s been other challenges as well. Achieving as a little old startup business, a european whole vehicle type approval, is a monumental task for us to take on and we’ve managed to do it. And it’s a credit to the whole team and demonstrated how we can get things done.
Ken Scott:
And one aspect of that included working with ZF. ZF are renowned automotive supplier for brake systems, et cetera. And for us, again, as a very small company, to knock on their door and gain approval with ZF, to apply their latest technology of advanced emergency braking systems to our product and for them to sign off that we could do that was a huge challenge and we achieved it. I think establishing a credible after sales solution for, again, a business like ours was a key challenge. And I think working with Alltruck has absolutely nailed that and given us a credible solution when we were all scratching our head as to how exactly we were going to do that. So thanks to Alltruck for everything so far on that relationship, I think supply chain challenges would be another one I’d put into the mix of answering that question. Every OEM has gone through a huge amount of challenges on the back of COVID on the back of chip shortages around the world and whatever else you want to put at it. And the smaller you are, the bigger these challenges have on you.
Ken Scott:
So, yeah, these are a few of the examples of the sort of things that we’ve had to overcome.
Georgia Lomas:
So how many tether trucks are operating on the UK roads currently and what’s the feedback from the customers?
Ken Scott:
We have a handful of trucks in operation right now and about another dozen in the final stages of production, including the body build and registration. The very first product has completed nearly 6000 miles in customer operation in the Manchester area and it’s hardly missed a beat day after day after day for six months of operation. This actually translates, and this is the important thing here, this translates to a saving so far of six tons of co2 compared to running a diesel, taking into account the green energy percentage from the grid. It’s also saved thousands of pounds in operating and maintenance costs for the customer. So all in all, fantastic for our customer. In terms of the actual driver, he loves the product. He’s come from a very noisy, rattly diesel into something that’s very quiet, very refined, has a lack of vibration, et cetera, and a far better environment to go into day after day. So he’s told me that if he has to go back to running a diesel again, he wants to leave, he wants to do something else because he loves it so much he can hear the radio.
Georgia Lomas:
Brilliant. So for anyone who’s considering a Tevva electric truck, could you tell us about the maintenance requirements?
Ken Scott:
Sure. Maintenance is hugely simplified compared to a diesel, meaning less time and less cost. There’s far fewer moving parts. Whilst we need technicians to be IMI high voltage trained, the only part that actually needs replacement is an easily accessible filter for the air compressor. So it’s revolutionary as people are finding if they’ve got EV cars. The reality of the services, et cetera, on an EV is much less than on the traditional diesels.
Georgia Lomas:
So you mentioned all truck earlier and early last year, Tevva appointed Alltruck as their 24/7 roadside assistance and fleet management partner. So how’s the partnership going?
Ken Scott:
Yeah, well, first of all, we’re delighted to be partnered with all truck. For us in our startup scale up phase, it’s important to partner with a company like Alltruck with their UK wide network to ensure our customers’uptime. By partnering with Alltruck, we can play to our strengths in producing electric trucks, reassured in the knowledge that Alltruck has the experience, but also to learn with Alltruck on any issues in the field. And as I said earlier, walk in our customer’s shoes as soon as there’s a problem. Alltruck share I have to say very similar values to Tevva, which is fantastic to be in partnership with somebody like that. Things like our customer obsession and our people focus makes it ideal to work with and develop as a relationship.
Georgia Lomas:
So how is Tevva helping and supporting customers who are looking to move over to electric or hydroelectric vehicles?
Ken Scott:
We’re working with customers as they transition to their EV purchase, which ultimately will be fleetwide in the coming years through things like the ability to trial our vehicles. Everybody’s nervous, is it going to work? Is it going to suit my needs? Am I going to be able to charge it? You mentioned the maintenance requirements. Best way is to try it. So we’re happy to work with customers to trial our vehicles for a period of time and to prove firsthand that it actually works and to gain confidence in it. I’d say also through ensuring we work with them on depot infrastructure charging solutions and through the ultra partnership as well, to be the familiar pursport of call for customers in the event of problems or for maintenance. Again, that makes it easy for customers to transition by doing something like that and directly from our UK base. Again, as I mentioned earlier, to be able to speak with and travel to customers, to support, answer questions and solve any problems is really important in the UK.
Georgia Lomas:
Do we have a suitable electric infrastructure to power the electrification of HGV? And if not, what needs to happen.
Ken Scott:
To get to this point in award? No. The challenge for the majority of customers for the electrification of HGVs is to have the charging infrastructure in depots as a first step. The more government grants an incentivisation for this, the easier it is for fleet operators to make the transition. Ultimately, public charging would also help, but of course, with the size of trucks, et cetera, that’s not that easy. We’re already seeing the challenge that there is for cars in the UK for public. You know, when you’ve got something the size of trucks, clearly that’s going to be an even bigger challenge. However, there’s a lot of overnight parking areas, there’s a lot of motorway service stations that could benefit from this sort of infrastructure and this sort of forward thinking on what’s going to be needed in the future. And again, the more that governments can get behind the need to decarbonise the transportation system, the more they can incentivise companies to put in that sort of infrastructure.
Ken Scott:
Ultimately, public charging would also help through any overnight parking, motorway service stations, et cetera, that could be benefited from having that infrastructure funded or part funded or incentivised through government support. There is recently announced initiatives like this. There’s one between gridserve and the UK gov, which is a collaboration doing exactly that, and I think we need more of it. But starting with in depot infrastructure is key, because a lot of duty cycles is depot to depot or depot to the same depot. Start with that, get that right and build it from there.
Georgia Lomas:
So, in your opinion, what needs to happen for us to meet the UK’s proposed 2035 ban on diesel vehicles at 26 ton and below?
Ken Scott:
Well, first of all, change the word proposed. Let’s make it definitive. The UK lags behind Europe in legislating this timing, and whilst it’s not legislated, it’s at risk of being delayed. Secondly, there needs to be some form of incentivisation for the customer buying the EV truck ahead of the legislative implementation date in the form of grants. That way we can get this trial period, it’s easier for customers to convert, et cetera. Currently, there is a grant available in the UK which is a total of 16,000 pounds. If the product itself qualifies for a plug in truck grant, the Tevva truck does qualify for that, so that’s all good news. Now, if you were in Germany, what you would get in the way of a grant is 80% of the difference between a diesel and an EV paid for by a government grant.
Ken Scott:
That absolutely knocks away the UK incentivisation proposal and it clearly shows a much more ambitious incentivisation from their government and is the sort of thing that we need to look at and consider, is there something that we could be doing to help with that? And then, on top of that, the infrastructure incentivisation I mentioned previously, coupled with green energy infrastructure like solar panels, et cetera, and customer depots, all of that goes along to sort of support the customer in transitioning to solving our environmental issues that we have with co2 and transportation.
Georgia Lomas:
So what advice would you give to somebody who is looking to electrify their hgv fleet?
Ken Scott:
Give it a go. Zero emission technology for trucks is coming. Fact. Get on board. It’s coming down the track very soon that we need to be fully ramping up this technology. Early adopters were past that phase. Get on with it. Contact Tevva, arrange a trial, understand how the current currently available EV truck solutions can be applied to their duty cycles and their current fleet and give it a go.
Ken Scott:
See the benefits in running costs, maintenance and overall TCO.
Georgia Lomas:
What exciting plans are on the horizon for Tevva?
Ken Scott:
Well, first of all, ramp up sales and production of the current seven and a half ton bev. That is our absolute focus right now. Get it into the UK, get it recognised and see the benefits with our customers. Then go into Europe, then bring to market the dual energy hydrogen electric solution that I talked about for the 19 ton truck. And in terms of with further funding, with investors, scale the business in all aspects to be a credible alternative to the traditional oems over the next two to three years. I think whilst we’re small, we’re agile, we can respond quickly, we can give that personal touch to customers. I’m really delighted and very excited to be part of a company like this right now that’s at the forefront of this sort of technology that is going to make a difference in terms of our humanity, our environment and decarbonising the transportation sector.
Georgia Lomas:
Brilliant. So for all of our listeners who are interested in the Tevva trucks, feel free to follow Tevva on all of their social media platforms and register for their email marketing newsletter which you can do through their website. Thank you so much for joining us and we are super excited to see what the future holds for Tevva.
Ken Scott:
Thank you for inviting me to participate in this. It was an absolute pleasure. And yeah, watch this space for more exciting developments.